Cage Match 2010, Round 1: 2) Cthulhu versus 31) Lyra Silvertongue



Image courtesy of Dominique Signoret


Image courtesy of New Line Cinema

Great Old One
Age: ??
Race: ??
Weapons / Artifacts: None
Special Attack: Drives all who see it to insanity

Lyra Silvertongue
Little girl
Age: 12
Race: Human
Weapons / Artifacts: Alethiometer
Special Attack: Talks a lot

  • Unfathomably huge–like, the size of a mountain
  • Inpires madness and terror in all who see it
  • Is an elder being

  • Can talk to her own soul
  • Can read the alethiometer
  • Extremely clever and persuasive

  • Might still be dreaming in R’lyeh

  • Is a child
How we think the fight will go

As Lyra stands on a cliff overlooking the ocean, a vast shadow begins to rise from the deep. Her hair whipping around her face, she raises the alethiometer, its dials spinning frantically as she tries to make a reading, any reading, about what will happen… but for once, the compass is useless. Pantalaimon whimpers from her coat pocket as the shadow swells, becoming first the size of a great ship, and then a mountain; and then a great wave reaches the shore, smashing the cliff face like a fist and sending fifty feet of rock tumbling into the water. Lyra’s eyes widen, and she looks up, and up, and up, and the Elder One opens its own eyes and fixes her with its ancient gaze from beyond the stars of any world she has known. Lyra drops to her knees and begins to weep as Pantalaimon writhes, withers, and collapses. Cthulhu is no longer fhtagn.

And then Cthulhu steps on her head.

Predicted Winner: Cthulhu

(Cthulhu is a character from the myriad writings of H. P. Lovecraft; Lyra Belacqua is a character from Philip Pullman’s His Dark Materials trilogy.)

Go to the previous match!

Back to the Bracket

  • Wiggy

    I can only assume that votes are being cast for Lyra humorously, since Cthulhu could take every other contestant in this whole shindig combined and not really even notice that they’re there.

  • A.M.

    I actually got goosebumps reading how the fight might go, just from imagining Cthulhu…

    Okay, just hear me out on this one before you vote.
    Obviously, we’re not talking about power vs. power. Cthulhu is an immortal primordial force, and nobody in this contest is equal to it in power. We all know the outcome of a straight-up “fight.”
    Meaning Lyra has as much chance as anyone. That is to say, “none at all.”
    But she has a somewhat better chance of taking care of Cthulhu the only way that it really can be done–with information. Guided by the alethiometer, Lyra has a reasonable shot at finding whatever Elder Sign or great seal or what have you that can keep Cthulhu dormant. I think that’s just the sort of quest she’d be good at. Combat power is no help against Cthulhu. Wits, information, and bravery are what give you a chance.
    I say all this because to me, nothing would be as predictable and frankly boring as watching Cthulhu work its way up the ranks to the chorus of “Cthulhu is the Most Powerful!” Where’s the fun in such a pre-ordained outcome?

  • Wiggy

    @ Grayson Towler:
    That’s a pretty good idea right there.
    But we all knew how this was going to go as soon as Cthulhu was put into this tournament. Once Cthulhu actually comes awake – once he is finished dying and then death dies – no combination of old magic or the Elder Sign wouldd be able to stop him. I don’t think Azathoth would be able to stop him at that point, if we go by Lovecraft’s original writings instead of the expanded mythos.
    Boring? Yeah. Yeah, it kind of is. Would have been more interesting if they had just included a certain someone from The Dunwich Horror.
    But they didn’t, so we’ve got Cthulhu. And Cthulhu goes all the way.

  • Tyler

    Poor Lyra not a lucky first draw

  • KnaveRupe

    I’m just looking forward to seeing The Big C take out that stupid lion.

  • Samuel

    Actually…I’m going with Grayson here. Lyra is (shockingly) really the best opponent for Cthulhu, aside from maybe Rand al’Thor or Aslan.
    The alethiometer is a powerful weapon against a mystical being like Cthulhu, and let’s face it, all Belacqua DOES is screw over more powerful adversaries (including a self-proclaimed god, once, one could argue).
    Also, again, my vote goes to Lyra because I honestly think she’s make for a better tournament. Otherwise, we’ll end up with Cthulhu versus Aslan in the end, one God against another, duking it out, boom boom. Yawn.
    Weird thing? Lyra might actually be able to get the better of Aslan too, once again because she wouldn’t use main force. Of course, she’s screwed if she meets someone the alethiometer or her girlish dimples couldn’t sway (e.g. the Shrike, Jaime Lannister, Roland Deschain), but I still think that she deserves to go further in this tournament.
    My vote goes to Belacqua.

  • Wiggy

    Okay I get now that people are voting for Lyra because Cthulhu is boring as a contestant (which is true).
    But what in the world would the alethiometer do to Cthulhu, exactly? I haven’t…. I haven’t read any Philip Pullman.

  • Samuel

    Well, really…no clue. This is all based on the assumption that there is any way, in heaven or earth, that Cthulhu might conceivably ever lose, whether it’s some mystical banishing ritual, something (anything!) that would affect him psychologically, whatever.
    The alethiometer would give Belacqua that information in seconds. And while Cthulhu is all but invulnerable, he’s also so huge that if she hid and ran long enough, he probably wouldn’t be able to get at her.

  • Wiggy

    Also a good plan! That is a good way to look at it. He probably would not notice her at all.
    But when Cthulhu wakes up he’s kind of destined to devour the entire universe.
    I just
    I don’t see any way around it.

  • Craig Bertuglia

    If you are reading this, I am dead and was not able to stop the Nameless Horror from beyond time and space. I set out with a group of fellow paranormal investigators from Miskatonic University to investigate a cult dedicated to using the internet to gain world dominion for their dark masters. All my friends are either dead or have gone insane due to the things we’ve uncovered along the way, and I have made it as far as the server room this “contest” is being run from. I should have known just getting to this room would not be the end… I can hear cultists chanting outside the barricaded door and now… for the love to all that’s holy… the servers are sprouting sickly green wet tentacles! They are reaching to me, knowing without eyes my very movements! This is no game but a way to dupe thousands into worshipping Cthulhu… and the only way to stop the madness is to vote against…sedg;OWEHBB;EKBW;’KLTGB’W[‘SLOgfkls’nhslkfdhn

  • Alessandro

    Let’s put things this way:
    Lyra kills God. Unambiguously, God dies and Lyra did it.
    For anyone who’s played Scribblenauts, we know that if you put God against Cthulhu, God wins that fight. (Cthulhu needs a shotgun to even stand a chance.) Therefore, God > Cthulhu.
    But by our earlier logic, Lyra > God. Therefore Lyra > Cthulhu.
    So how do you vote otherwise?

  • Damian

    I’m voting against Cthulu because I’m so bloody tired of Cthulu name-dropping. Every loudmouth, greasy dude in a black duster brings him into any conversation edging into fantasy like it’s some hipster-dork badge of honor to have read their Lovecraft, but all they ever say is “Cthulu would just eat (insert name)’s face!”
    Personal bias much? Certainly. But if that’s the crew Cthulu brings to this fight, he loses by default.
    Sorry. Pet peeve of mine.

  • Samuel

    Hm…well (weak argument)…Lyra does tend to skip through different universes a lot.
    Yeah, I dunno.
    I DO see a way around this, though, and it is…
    Don’t vote for the squid dude.
    Otherwise, it’ll just keep going like this, force against force, and Cthulhu and Aslan will be the last two competitors. Then Aslan will crush Cthulhu, and that’ll be it.
    *Jesus winks slyly at the camera, and the Mormon Tabernacle choir erupts into Hallelujahs*
    I…honestly don’t want to see things go that way. Introducing a boring-ass god (come on, nerds, he really is) into this tournament wasn’t a great idea to start out with, but now he’s here…
    *Whispers* Let’s get rid of him. Humans are GOOD at killing gods.

  • Wiggy

    He’s not boring!
    It’s jsut that putting him into a “tournament” where people from fiction fight each other is immensely imbalanced and very, very, very stupid. He functions great in the context of the stories which involve him (of which he has become the subject of too much attention, alas).
    And odn’t worry! Cthulhu and Aslan will probably face off in the semi-finals! So…. so the end will probably be Cthulhu vs. Gandalf.
    ….I think I see what you mean.

  • Peter JΓΈrgensen

    It is a bit like The Shrike vs. Arthur Dent fight.
    If it was just a question of raw force the Shrike and Cthulhu would win.
    But some contenders have other strengths. And as has been mentioned, going on a quest for an ancient an powerful godkilling artifact is just the kind of thing Lyra does best.
    I still voted for Cthulhu. But Lyra would stand a chance. The arguments for the underdog, ahowing of your geeking skills is the most fun part of this kind of tournament.
    Sadly, Lyra is actually one of the only Godkillers, in the field.
    Guess Raestlin has also killed uber powerful evil gods before.
    And of course Aslan could possibly take him with brute force.

  • leftfootofjustice

    …and cthulu steps on her head…the most accurately portrayed fight i’ve read so far.

  • MAB

    By virtue of magic every wizards on the list technically have a way to seal Chtulhu away. For myself I believe that Rand Al Thor would be the best candidate to defeat Chtulhu or at least reseal him away. There is no limit to his power and he’s already mad. he would unleash all he has, destroy the world and be reborn again.
    This being said, this will likely end up being a popularity contest and in fiction anything can happen. If the current votes hold I’m so voting for Jaime Lannister against Cthulu on round 2!

  • Samuel

    This being said, this will likely end up being a popularity contest and in fiction anything can happen. If the current votes hold I’m so voting for Jaime Lannister against Cthulu on round 2!
    /agrees fervently

  • TVila

    Against anyone else, else of these champions would lead to predictable ends.
    But Lyra has got to have like +15 against gods, right? It’s the only reason to even have her around.

  • Shen

    Hey, if anyone can stop Cthulhu its Conan. He has killed off his share of huge, tentacled, slimy gods of doom. Cthulhu wouldn’t even know what hit him.

  • AHEM

    Lyra did not kill God. At least, she did not kill anything that is anywhere near the idea of God as described in most religions. The thing she killed was neither omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, etc. Philip Pullman even stated that the Authority is not the Creator of anything. In a fight, Cthulhu > Authority.

  • votermom

    I had to vote for Lyra, because you know after a nice chat with Cthulhu she would be appointed his Viceroy or something. She’s not called Silvertongue for nothing.

  • T-rex92

    I’m voting for Lyra only because Cthulhu is overpowered.Tehnically he beats the crap out of all of the contestants,maybe even Aslan.And I must admit,I’m a fan of “A song of fire and ice” of G.R.R.M and as Jamie is the representant of that series I want him to go as far as possible.A fight with Cthulhu will not end good for his opponent,but what can Lyra do against Jamie??I say: “nothing”!So vote for Lyra to save Jamie’s ass.

  • Ganieda

    I figured this was a no brainer, but somehow…You guys have actually sold me on Lyra.
    Well that and yeah, talk about a boring fight if he just keeps rising through the ranks.
    And who says Cthulhu actually wakes up for this little shindig, anyway?

  • bracketpath

    voted for cthulhu on instinct, but on looking at the other remotely plausible “cthulhu-killers” in the contest, and where they are bracket-wise, i’d rather see lyra win this.
    rand al’thor is the only one in the contest who is built for this, he’s practically on home turf, but they would have to be facing off *in the final*, it’s the only way they meet. gandalf (also must be in final) or aslan (semi-final) obviously stand a better than average chance, and all three of these guys will probably need to go through resurrection to claim their ribbon. i don’t see any victory in shrike vs. cthulhu, perhaps battle without end. after that, lyra actually stands a better chance than just about anyone, so if *anyone* could do it before the final, she should have a shot.
    plus it might be fun to see lannister march to the semifinals over the corpses of dead girls. or if jaime falls to anita in the quarters, that could be a good one.

  • Bill

    This is my favorite fight synopsis so far. I’ve read it a dozen times. After I post this, I will go and read it again, because it makes me smile.
    As for those of you who think Cthulu vs Aslan will be boring….
    Why, pray tell, are you participating in a Cage Match voting poll if you feel that cage matches between god-like beings is….boring?
    You came here to see your favorite heroes square off in epic battles. Lets cut the clever crap and get to it. Bring on the epic blood baths.

  • David

    God in the Pullman books is a far cry from what most would think of as God. He’s basically a shriveled up, powerless old husk of what he once was, which appears to have been just the most powerful of Angels. Now Metatron is quite powerful in those books, and so is Lord Azriel.
    The point is well taken that given enough time Lyra might be able to use the Alethiometer to find some means to keep Cthulhu from waking…for now, but in the end Cthulhu is the one with time on his side. He sleeps, he waits dreaming. If his time doesn’t come now, it will come eventually, long after Lyra is gone, and that’s something poor Lyra just can’t beat.

  • Evan

    Okay, seriously, who put Cthulhu into this match? Nobody beats freakin’ Cthulhu. (Well, okay, maybe Raistlin Majere could pull it off. Killing evil gods is kind of his shtick, after all.)
    But still, dropping Cthulhu into this tournament is like putting a guy on horseback in an Olympic sprinting event.
    Of course, mainly I’m bitter because Cthulhu’s next matchup is almost certainly going to be Jaime Lannister, and poor Jaime stands just about as much chance as Lyra did.

  • Ben Lehman

    What the hell, people? Cthulu is basically worthless: a big squid that makes people crazy. Lyra handily dispatches far worse in her books. Including (spoilers) she kills God Himself. After that, Cthulu is pretty much not even an issue.

  • JJDownes

    OK its kind of obvious that Cthulu will win this. But lets be honest dont you think he is a bit too good? Well unless lyra suddenly gets the hordes of Polar Bears on her side, and angels, and the various other friends she picked up on the way… OH and dont forget the harpies. I take it back, this would be a good fight πŸ˜€

  • ROMP

    Cthulu will romp through the ranks here.
    Vote Lyra and keep it interesting & entertaining.

  • There is only one thing that I can say to explain my vote for Cthulhu:
    Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn!

  • Jenna Moran

    It seems to me that Cthulhu is elevated above “giant fish thing” only by the tenet of his universe that both human morality and human rationality are meaningless—that there is a fundamental coldness and alien hostility to the cosmos. That the only bargain between spirit/meaning and the flesh is that spirit is strange and alien in its shapelessness; and flesh, perverted, misshapen, and weak.
    Without that, without that being *true*, the truth behind all truths, he is a priest of a false idea.
    Lyra comes from a very different cosmos. She comes from a world where she’s directly observed what lies behind the veil of matter. It’s not cold alien hostility. It’s Dust.
    She isn’t like some random scientist or priest facing Cthulhu. She isn’t just generically confident in faith or reason, but poised on seeing Cthulhu to realize that that confidence is misplaced.
    She *knows* that souls are meaningful. She knows that spirit loves the mortal flesh. These aren’t theories to her. They’re things she’s *seen*.
    Now, it’s not clear in a cage match like this whose cosmology reigns supreme. I mean, I’m disinclined to casually say, “Cthulhu sees the Dust around her. Recognizing that his entire worldview is meaningless, he goes mad!”
    And I’m also disinclined to assume that Lyra has an experience of that sort.
    But I will note that humans are probably going to break ties in favor of human morality, rationality, and dignity. So, whether she’d be right or wrong to do so, I’d think Lyra can ignore the metaphysical implications that usually impress themselves on people seeing Cthulhu. I think she could look at him, particularly if she had a little preparation, without immediately going mad.
    And I think that if you defang the weighty meaninglessness of the cosmos that looms behind and around Cthulhu, if you deny it and strip it of its maddening power, that Lyra would be as capable as anybody else (except maybe Ender) of hitting a giant squid-faced dude
    in the head
    with a ship.
    Heck. For that matter, Lyra would be more capable than almost anybody (*even* Ender) of breaking the ill-formed cosmic principles that keep Cthulhu and his ilk antagonistic to human lives and works. For who better than Lyra to see past the insistent despair of the Mythos’ cosmic order—to recognize it as a house in disarray, twisted in on itself as if by an originating demiurge that knew the forms of architecture but not their substance? Who better than Lyra to grasp in the Mythos’ endless obsession with the convoluted, palpating viscerality of flesh a twisted reiteration of the love of Dust for matter? To connect the relentless character of torment and bleakness pervading the Mythos with its chosen conception of the roles of self and spirit, to understand the priesthood of the nuclear chaos as a confused attempt at self-intercision? As the soul of the world, broken by the weight of false ideas, striving to cut itself from the flesh?
    And who better than a perverse, inexplicable congeries of girl and daemon—of human person and that shifting shapeless blasphemy we call the soul—to show Cthulhu a way to break the endless emptiness of his world? To be a psychopomp unto him, to make a spiritual path for him, to lead him from his current state into being a functional part of a new and humane order? Who better to offer his world a new contract between flesh and spirit, then one already thus contracted?
    as we’ve said,
    to hit him in the head with a ship, such as Lyra is sometimes, well, on.
    It’s a lot of damage!
    A ship, I mean.
    It’s a lot of damage. It’s a really brutal kind of attack.
    If Lyra had ever hit you in the head with a ship you would definitely know.

  • EM

    I think Lyra would actually have a pretty good chance to defeat Cthulhu if she could team up with Will.
    The combination of the alethiometer (that makes them pretty much omniscient) and the Subtle knife (that gives them the ability to travel anywhere in any universe instantaneously and to cut up literally anything) is extremely potent, and it would give them the ability to first flee Cthulhu by jumping into a parallel universe and then ask the alethiometer if the great old one has any weaknesses of any kind. If it’s anything physical, they would be able to get it or use the subtle knife to destroy it. If the trick lies with another being, Lyra could probably use her silver-tongue to talk it into helping them.
    They might even be able to sneak up beside Cthulhu by cutting a gate next to him and stab the great old one with the subtle knife, since the blade is so sharp it would be able to cut him even if he isn’t completely physical.
    This does, of course, assume that 1) Cthulhu actually has any weaknesses and 2) that Lyra and Will doesn’t go mad immediately.

  • Gus

    Lyra is a lucky little thing and hence the stars will be wrong and Cthulhu will not show. Winner by default.

  • Quibby

    as we’ve said,
    to hit him in the head with a ship, such as Lyra is sometimes, well, on.”
    In response to that, this actually happened in ‘The Call of Cthulhu,’ and it resulted in Cthulhu’s head bursting like a rancid bubble, then reforming with no damage done. I can kinda-sorta see the rest of it, but Lovecraft’s own text on the matter shows that particular action wouldn’t do anything.

  • Sarah

    She already killed a god.
    She could break Chthulhu over her knee.

  • Um. She beat GOD, people! So I don’t think she’d lose to half-god half-octopus thing whose powers boil down to “lookin’ at you real scurry-like.”

  • Skithee

    I said this in the main thread, and I’ll say it again.
    You can’t beat Cthulhu in a fist fight. You’ve gotta fight fire with fire. And what might actually snap the mind of Cthulhu? Why, seeing a cute, miniature Cthulhu following around a little girl! “What the… man, I’m going back to sleep.”

  • AHEM

    You can’t say that Lyra would beat Cthulhu because she “beat God.” That’s an extreme fallacy of logic, the type utilized by desperate idiots on the verge of defeat.
    Firstly, it is entirely possible for A to defeat B and B to defeat C, but for A to be unable to beat C. That’s the idea of Rock-Paper-Scissors, for example. Rock beats scissors, but it doesn’t necessarily beat paper, even though scissors do.
    But that hardly matters, considering that Lyra did not fight anything at even a remotely god-like level. The “God” she supposedly defeated and killed could have been finished off by a five year old. Cthulhu is well above that level, and above Lyra’s level.
    Besides, after the travesty to logic and sheer idiocy that Jaime vs. Hermione turned out to be, I have to confess I’m almost eager to see Jaime get his mind broken and his body torn asunder by Cthulhu.

  • woot

    Cthulhu wins, obviously, to anyone who knows anything about the Great Old Ones. Only person in this contest that beats Cthulu hands down is Rand al’Thor, through the use of Balefire.

  • Samuel

    After some thought, I’ve decided how I think this should go down:
    Mighty Cthulhu lumbered up out of the ocean, bearing down on the tiny blond figure before him. But suddenly, it gave a shrill cry.
    “Cthulu! Cthulhu! That’s your name, en’t it? The alethiometer says you’ve come for the whole world!”
    Cthulhu did not deign to reply, but picked up the pace.
    “Wait! You’ll be sorry if you don’t! There’s another world, and I know how to get to it!”
    Cthulhu was mildly amused by this silliness.
    “It’s called Cittagazze, and it’s lovely, much nicer than this one. It’s got towers and spires and great brick buildings! You’d love it there, I know you would! I’ll show you, if you promise to eat that world intstead!”
    The specificity of this intrigued Cthulhu, and he decided that, as he fully intended to eat both this world and this impertinent miniscule female anyway, what could it hurt if he was on the lookout for desert? He nodded his vast head gravely, and the tiny blond figure set off, bouncing and gesticulating, shouting out to him.
    “This way! I’ll show you!”
    Soon enough, the two reached a device in the snow.
    “This used to be my father’s. Lord Azriel,” went on the child. “He left, got through Cittagazze to somewhere else, but I don’t think we can do that, ’cause I en’t got the knife anymore, and Will’s not here to use it anyway. But Cittagazze is much prettier than that other place, you’ll see, and…”
    Mighty Cthlhu’s head was beginning to ache from the tiny creature’s prattling, and he felt vaguely that he should like to squash her. But he reminded his godly self that he must forebear, at least until she was proven a liar.
    “Now we need a child, you know, and their daemon.”
    Fetching these articles was no problem for mighty Cthulhu, and soon the gate between worlds was open wide. Cthulhu, who had been wondering how this singularly annoying specimen of vermin would feel under his enormous foot with some gloating anticipation was taken aback.
    The tiny creature charged up the ramp into the sky, waving for him to follow. “Come on! It’s up here! I’ll show you! It’s ever so nice!”
    Mighty Cthulhu followed, secure in the knowledge that nothing could destroy him anyway.
    He stepped off the edge of the archway…directly into the thousands of Specters created by the rift opening. As Mighty Cthulhu set about stomping and smashing them, the blond female and her daemon jauntily crossed back over the bridge of light as the flocks of angels descended to near-instantly close the wall between worlds, just as they had promised they would.

  • Wanderhome

    And here I thought Jaime Lannister vs Hermione Granger was a mismatch…

  • K

    Nah, I’m sure the alethiometer isn’t useless here. It tells her the truth about Cthulhu.
    This is exactly why Lyra is unlikely to upset this match.

  • siim

    Read the comments.
    You convinced me.
    Vote goes for Lyra.

  • Lord Nabu

    There are plenty of Characters that can defeat Cthulhu, if you are willing to accept, that his cosmology does not reign supreme. Conan more or less kills ancient ones frequently, Aslan is far more powerful than him, Raistin, Rand and the shrike, Gandalf is also beyond human, as per my post in the Shrike vs. Arthur Dent thread, Cthulhu is also powerless against Arthur Dent because that is the kind of battle AD wins through sheer bizarrenes and deliberate plot armour. the argument can be made that even if his mindwarping power is in effect quite a few of these characters have minds that can’t be as easily broken as all that.

  • bobxyzp

    Lyra: Oh no, I’d better read the alethiometer!
    Alethiometer: You are about to die.

  • Go God-killer!

    If Lyra manages to kill the omnipotent God himself, how can someone like Cthulhu have a chance? Besides, scientia est potentia, also.

  • Skithee

    I was also really hoping to see Jaime Lannister vs Panserbjorn.

  • Somebot

    Okay, I’d love Cthulu to win this battle any day, but in order for this tourney to be even partially interesting, he needs to go to sleep after this next fight… or else it’ll be Aslan vs. Cthulu… as we’re probably all expecting…

  • Stig

    Doh, this is a *cage*fight remember?
    Cthulhu will be disqualified for not fitting in the cage.

  • James H.

    Actually, it would be Cthullu and Aslan in the semis and the winner of that against Gandalf in the Finals.

  • Wiggy

    Even if Cthulhu’s cosmology doesn’t reign supreme, I’m ot sure it really matters – it’s said that he will end up devouring the entire universe, (assumedly) including his own universe’s equivalent of God, Azathoth.

  • Thaler

    I would like to register my disappointment that her disadvantages are listed as “little girl” and not as “child” or something. What do you have against girls? Its not as if her chances of winning against CTHULU are decreased because she is female.

  • kheller

    Thaler – It’s a good point. Fixed.

  • Trex

    Please vote for Lyra or else this whole tournament will become boring,just watching him passing through ranks until the finals.It’s not fair for the other contestants.

  • dpomerico

    “Poor Lyra not a lucky first draw.”
    Understatement of the first round?

  • Citizen

    I agree, Lyra + Will actually have as good a shot as anybody against Cthulhu. Use the atheliometer to figure out how best to employ the subtle knife so that various parts of Cthulhu end up in different universes, and then use the knife to cut a path into round two.

  • Cronolynx

    well, no one can truly beat Cthulu only delay the inevitable…the question is can this girl delay the Inevitable Probably not her, but I gaurantee there is someone in this tournemant that can.

  • flyerfan

    Lyra is British, and lacks the advantage of either being James Bond* or being written by Charles Dickens.
    The only way victory would be LESS possible for her is if she were French.
    Cthulhu stomps his way to round two.
    *James Bond should have gotten Cthulhu’s place in this tournament, he’s not nearly as game-breaking, and alot of those gadgets were sci-fi back in the 60s and 70s. And James Bond vs. Locke Lamora would have been a far more kickass scenario than Rand vs. Locke.

  • Kyle

    For all of you who think it will be Cthulhu vs Aslan in the semi-finals you are mistaken. It will be Cthulhu vs Raistlin. Raistlin has to be the most powerful character in this entire tournament. I understand that Aslan is a God, but Raistlin defeated Gods. GODS! with an “s.” As in more than one! Maybe I’m a little bias towards these two characters but I would LOVE to see a Raistlin vs Gandalf matchup in the finals and watch the universe cease to exist!

  • Lord Nabu

    you do understand that Aslan isn’t A god, he is God with a capital G?

  • Lichschool

    If Cthulhu wakes up, reality unravels.
    Game, set, match.

  • khazoolu

    Despite this seeming to be the biggest shut-out of the first round, it’s seemingly unbalanced pairing has sparked some interesting discussion, so I’m glad it’s here.
    First, I want to note two things:
    1. People have looked upon Cthulhu and not gone mad. Not immediately anyways. In Lovecraft’s “Call of Cthulhu”, second mate Johanssen sees Cthulhu, even tries to ram him with his ship (as mentioned above by Jenna and Quibby) and manages to maintain his sanity in the long run. His hair turns white, his spirit is from then on broken, and the ship he was on is found floating aimlessly, but still he makes it. It doesn’t sound like much, but I think it’s worth noting.
    2. The influence of Cthulhu is strongest on “sensitive”, imaginative people and Lyra is no such person. The main character of Lovecraft’s stories, the inquisitive scientific gentleman is at times accompanied by some bluff authoritative working class fellow, like a police officer. This staunch, unimaginative type is less shaken by what they witness as he does not draw the same dread cosmic connections. And it is specifically noted that Lyra is able to be braver than other children because she is unimaginative. That is to say, she does not go on flights of fancy, imagining and fretting what her enemies might have planned for her.
    Also, Cthulhu is not necessarily a god. We just think Cthulhu is a god for the same reason our prehistoric ancestors thought of the sea, sky and moon as gods, because we could not understand them. Cthulhu is like the inky blackness just beyond the limit of the few meager lights humanity has managed to cast upon the world. Does that make Cthulhu less of a threat?
    Finally, and I’ve heard this echoed in other threads including this one, this would be more interesting if we took “cage match” less literally. We can’t just assume the powers that be shove two beloved (or despised) literary characters into a room together and say “good luck fellas! We’ll open the door when one of you is dead!” In that case, the character who has strangled a wizard to death, or chopped off a nazi redneck’s head, or shoved a nosy kid out a window before breakfast would just smile and get on with their butcher’s work. It’s more fun to see what the characters could do to each other, given certain circumstances. That does make the outcome kind of arbitrary though.
    I know, I know. Tl;dr.

  • Poor Lyra. Poor poor girl. If I thought my vote could do anything to save her, I’d throw it her way.

  • Nikhil

    I really wanted Lyra to win this one, if only to make Jaime Lannister face two little girls in a row.

  • Billy Ann

    Erm… I mean, when she sees him, wouldn’t she just panic, scream, run around and go crazy? He’s an EVIL, DISGUSTING God (not simply a God) humongous, has dragon wings, tentacles (hihi), and is slimy. Even if she’s unimaginaive, all the slime alone will freak her out… I mean, she is girl, even if she’s a girl from a book.. so I suppose, she’d rather kill herself than get crushed by Cthulhu…
    And don’t get me wrong, I’m a girl too, and I have a very clear view of what I would do if I saw Chtulhu – faint. She may have killed God (a very lame thing to do, if you ask me), she has done nothing to prepare her for meeting Chtulhu.. and if he’s informed that he must kill her, won’t he just unleash all he’s got and kill her in a blink?

  • Sherman

    just need to say, That old Cthulhu isn’t as all powerfull as u guys make him out. Rastlin has killed gods, and Rand was born to defeat the dark one, being of all evil, and face it half the ppl on the lists are god-slaying super humans. Cthulhu just happens to be the god fighting the god-slayers.

  • Kyhkaen

    You do realize that several of the other characters have actual experience at killing gods? Raistlin Majere has already killed 3 by himself. Not by some super-weapon or luck of the draw, but by force of will alone. Sorry Cthulhu, you’re awesome and all, but you’re just a god.

  • The Mad Arab

    I won’t even bother to go on about how this match was incredibly one-sided, others have done that already. I would like to point out the fact that some of these characters killing “gods” has no basis being mentioned in this context. What Lyra fought was not in Cthulhu’s league. Hell my mother could have beaten that. Raistlin did not actually defeat anything himself, his whole plan relied on using the gods against themselves. And if Balefire could stop Cthulhu so simply . . .
    . . . he wouldn’t be Cthulhu.
    You are putting all your hopes in children, old fogies, gods with animal complexes, and madmen. Against something against which reality itself stands little chance. Regarldess of his powerlevel making him a mismatch here, he is the only logical choice for winner of this tournament. Madness is not his only power, I mean, he’s gigantic! I like Conan and all, but can you picture him beating a mountain with a sword?
    Here’s my idea: let’s all watch Cthulhu grab one of these combatants like a club and use him/her to bludgeon the rest of them to death as they all gibber helplessly and foam at the mouth.
    Men will fall, magic will fail, worlds will die. Game over, man.
    Game over.

  • Wanderhome

    I agree with you… mostly.
    Cthulhu may be a god with power beyond the comprehension of man, but Aslan is capital-“G” God with literal omnipotence.
    Cthulhu can beat any other challenger from this list, but when he faces Aslan, the lion wins because of the difference between “powerful” and “all-powerful.”

  • The Mad Arab

    If Aslan was all-powerful, he wouldn’t have needed the Scooby Gang and their talking gopher to save the day. Sorry, but Cthulhu is going all the way. A few kids and some zoo animals do not trump reality-destroying all consuming madness.
    He is, for all intents and purposes immune to death. Hence the couplet oft-quoted in Lovecraft’s works concerning the great Old One: “That is not dead which can eternal lie,
    And with strange aeons even death may die.” It took the greatest power in that entire continuum to lock him away. Note: that “all-powerful” being had not the power to destroy such a being as Cthulhu. They could merely contain him.
    Look – I have read almost all of the series on this list to some extent. I admit Aslan is Cthulhu’s best opponent. Everyone else is just a man (or a machine in some cases). No matter their power, men (or women) cannot hope to compete. I’m not saying this just because I happen to like Cthulhu, because I have the Lovecraft collection and all that, I’m saying it because it IS Cthulhu.
    He does not care what his opponents have to say. He does not know fear or love or remorse or mercy of any kind. I’m sure he would eat Balefire for breakfast and not even use milk. Those on this list that can ressurect from death would have to die first, and as such would lose the match for it. Logic dictates what I have known all along:
    Cthulhu wins.
    And then he eats all authors just to be sure.

  • Samuel

    Actually, Aslan could and would win. The sense of the Narnia books is NOT that Aslan necessarily needed the Pevensies, just that he allowed it to happen that way. Like the Judeo-Christian God he’s so transparently based on, Aslan is a creature of free will. He allows mortals to make choices that govern the future. He guides, he helps, he even ends up doing some of the dirty work when the chips are down, but he doesn’t set anything in motion himself. The characters in the story have to make their own choices.
    That is not, necessarily, how he would react to a direct threat to himself, rather than just one of the many universes he apparently watches over. Aslan destroyed one of these at the end of the Chronicles, and all the bad guys perished. Cthulhu has never left our reality, to my knowledge. He was in fact “born” in our reality, traveled through space, and landed on earth. He’s a space alien. He’s not governor over all universes.
    At the very least, we have seen that Cthulhu is defeatable. He can get banished, by an “omnipotent power”.
    Does anyone, even for a second, doubt that, as imagined by Lewis, that supereminent Christian, Jesus Christ was NOT an omnipotent power?
    The only way Aslan goes down is if, once again, he goes up against someone purely good, whom he would hesitate to destroy.

  • pale corbie

    I don’t know what would happen if Stormbringer (Elric’s weapon) ate an Elder God, but I think the concept “chaotic tentacle apocalypse” would be involved.
    I want to see.

  • The Mad Arab

    That logic is sort of a trap. Yes, Lewis wrote him to be all powerful and unbeatable. But the same could be said about almost every character on this list. by that logic Rand would be facing off against Gandalf on the strength of fanboys alone.
    What I’m saying is that anything that has a mind can lose it. God or no God, everything on this list is vunerable to Cthulhu’s power. Even if he loses to Aslan the chances are that the lion goes mad and eats reality anyways. in that scenario, lose as he might the match, Cthulhu wins the war.
    I stand by my conviction. The End is Nigh! The Dreamer awakens! Insert random doomsaying here! πŸ™‚

  • Samuel

    Inaccurate. Rand al’Thor is defeatable. So is Gandalf. Neither was written as an all-powerful character. al’Thor can wield the One Power, but so can many others in his world. The Dark One is far more powerful than Rand. Likewise, Gandalf is a Maiar, not a Valar. He is the equivalent of an angel. Going up against Sauron directly, he would have been crushed. It’s even been suggested that the Witch-King could have defeated him, if he wasn’t distracted by the arrival of the Rohirrim.
    All of these characters were written as defeatable, except one. Aslan. That is my point, clear as day. There are no logical fallacies involved. No one else on this list was written as an ultimate power. As such, it’s really a silly idea to include Aslan, granted, but to suggest that he could be beaten through main force by something that was written as vulnerable to such a power is absurd.

  • The Mad Arab

    You think Cthulhu was written to be defeatable? Not so! He was written so as to not be able to warp and/or devour reality in the first story he was in. No character can step into any battle and use his own story as a trump.
    “This is a note from my author, I win. Sorry.”
    Therefore in this context Aslan, as much as Cthulhu or any other entry here, is defeatable. And again, vunerable to the Great Old One’s might. I don’t think he could win such a battle.
    Is Cthulhu vunerable as well? Yes. Does any other entry on this list possess sufficient power to do such a task? Not in my eyes, no. I wait with relish to see what transpires. Cthulhu also waits with relish. Though I believe he prefers ketchup.

  • Samuel

    Dude, now you’re just inventing arguments to keep your favorite looking good. Essentially, what your argument is goes something like this:
    “Cthulhu’s power from Lovecraft’s books show that he can do this and this and this to anyone. However, by the rules of the contest, we can’t take those other books seriously.”
    I say again. Aslan was written, by Lewis, with the quality of omnipotence. Just as Jaime Lannister was written with the quality of blond hair, or Cthulhu was written with the quality of being able to reform himself (but apparently not kill anyone else) after that ship slashed him in half in his first story.
    Aslan could be forced to withdraw by a good person coming up against him, by his nature as described in Lewis’s books. Force from an entity of lesser power than himself, however, would not seem to work.
    Look at it this way. If we take, in each universe, a list of most powerful to least powerful, Cthulhu comes in second in his. Aslan comes in first in his. Unless you devolve the argument into “but…but Lovecraft’s universe is just…just BETTER!”, then there’s no way past this. Aslan is omnipotent. It’s a power. Cthulhu can drive people nuts. Except, apparently, an omnipotent power. Oops.

  • The Mad Arab

    No, what I’m saying is that Cthulhu was written the way he was, as “second in power” because otherwise his first story would have been his last.
    “There once was a being named Cthulhu. He devoured reality. The end.”
    It was a plot hook. Such as omnipotence. I”m not saying that Cthulhu is going to win because I like him the best. (My favorite on this list is Conan, which in and of itself is connected to the Cthulhu mythos.) I’m saying that I think his power is great enough to trump all others here. It’s my opinion, simply put. As Aslan being all powerful is yours. I’m not trying to convert you. Just putting my point out there.
    People are voting against Cthulhu because they think he’s too powerful. You’re saying that Aslan could think this entire tournament into nothingness. I think you just bought him a few counter votes. πŸ™‚
    My vote goes for Cthulhu. It will be that way no matter who the opponent is. As I expect your to be for Aslan. May the best God-Being win.

  • Samuel

    Ahh, but I speak not of opinions, lawlz. I speak of reason. Whatever the rational for making Cthulhu second best, the fact remains that he is. As the lion is first.
    I repeat: omnipotence is not a plot hook. It is a quality that the character possesses.
    Of course we can say “This is my opinion, this guy’s awesome, I’m sticking to him”. But if we want this to have any semblance of point rather than a sheer popularity contest, we have to take their differing powers into account. It’s the same as we would do with, say, Conan versus Drizzt, or whoever else. We have to establish some means of comparison, otherwise the process is entirely nebulous.
    Granted, this is getting a bit serious for something this geeky anyway, xD, but I’m at this point mostly arguing on behalf of at least doing it right if we’re going to do it.
    I, for my part, am no better than anyone else for this. I fully intend to vote for Jaime Lannister, knowing he will lose, just b/c I think he’s a remarkable character and deserves an extra vote. But, reasonably, I will admit that he has no chance in heaven or earth of beating Cthulhu.
    Do you see the distinction?

  • The Mad Arab

    I see your distinction. It is you who fail to see mine. This is all I will say on the matter: Aslan is only omnipotent as long as Lewis is writing him. Here, he is goverened by the same laws as every other character. He is vunerable no matter who he is on his own world. Here, he is a god no greater or worse than any other god. Even Cthulhu. I don’t count any of these characters as THE god. They are characters. No matter what your feelings on the matter are that is the reality of this fantasy situation. Good does not always win in these battles – some of us are rooting for evil.
    Your worries should not be Cthulhu right now as far as the finals go. Aslan has a few “god killers” to go through long before he fights the Great Old One. Until then, I have said what I will say.

  • Samuel

    Actually, I think you misunderstand me. xD, as per your rather unsubtle hints, you seem to grow weary of our little debate. Never fear, I shall be brief, merely alleviating any misconceptions. You are under no obligation to respond to me.
    What I am trying to put across by repeating Aslan’s omnipotence is not that he is invincible in the competition but rather this: Cthulhu is not omnipotent. Not in his own universe. Aslan is omnipotent. One is a god who in his own world enough power to control everything. One is a god who does not have sufficient power to do that.
    Therefore, as far as my humble line of reasoning goes, Aslan > Cthluhu. More powerful, more likely to win. That’s all.

  • SITB

    Cthulhu is merely a Great Old one- a priest of the outer gods. Yes, he is godlike to our own human eyes but he isn’t anywhere near the big boys in the mythos while Aslan is Jesus. A more matched fight would be Aslan versus Nylarlahotep.

  • The Mad Arab

    I was seriously NOT going to comment. But a few things here keep recurring and it bothers me:
    1- It doesn’t matter who a character was based on. Be it Jesus, Chuck Norris, Willaim “Captain James T. Kirk” Shatner, or even Bruce Lee. It’s the character himself that’s involved. Leave Jesus out of this, that’s not an instant win.
    2- The terms “All Powerful” and “Omnipotent” have no business being mentioned. This entire tournament is based on votes. A character’s personal power might be why you vote for them, but it’s the votes that win here. Not “My God is better than your God.” Any character here could have been taken out by Edward Cullen if enough pre-teen girls knew about this contest. In example I give you Harry Dresden. A wizard. Potent, powerful, capable of things mortals can only imagine. Yet and still he was shown his own internal organs up close by Conan who has not a stitch of “power.” Because Conan had the power that mattered – the ONLY power that matters in this contest – votes.
    3- Resurrection requires being killed first, yes? Then I suppose everyone can stop mentioning it as a power herein, as these are fights TO THE DEATH. If you’ve come back to life, you were dead. If you were dead, you lost. End of story.
    Not arguing which character is better than any other. Just pointing out some things people keep harping on. Carry on.

  • Samuel

    I’m not really sure how (or if) any of that responds to my point…so let me just say..
    You seem fixated on the whole “omnipotent” thing. No one’s said Aslan is omnipotent in this tournament. It’s just a comparitor for relative power levels between two characters. One has n level of power in his world, one has x level. If n is greater than x, he with n is more likely to win. It’s the same as if we’re comparing an expert swordsman, best in his universe, and a pretty good swordsman, maybe competitive for number three in his. We are generally going to assume that the former is going to take the win. We can’t KNOW, of course, but that’s the only real point of posting in these comments sections, to bring things like this up.
    I agree that this contest shall be mostly decided on fan votes: good observation. It does not, however, explain why, if that’s your conviction, you spent half a dozen posts trying to argue for Cthulhu’s ultimate victory in a rational, comparative manner.
    I’m a bit confused, tbh.

  • The Mad Arab

    Actually, you have said multiple times that Aslan is omnipotent. My point here is that such power does not equal win. And whether or not he is more powerful than Cthulhu at all is debatable. I certainly don’t think so. πŸ™‚
    My point for Cthulhu’s victory, ultimately, boils down to the fact that though some of these characters might indeed possess the power to at least lock him away. Not knowing he is at best “Immune” to death, they would go for the kill first and foremost. And get trounced when their attack fails. Madness, or tentacles, or huge-mendous foot stomping down. Any of the above.
    What we can say for certain is that none of these characters has ever faced anything like Cthulhu before. He easily physically dwarfs any opponent here, and most of the swordsmen wouldn’t even be noticed. I simply think that a being such as Cthulhu would not view any of these creatures as a threat. Once wakened, he would simply do what he does best.
    By the by, none of this is at all personal or me trying to be a perfectionist. I have simply read ALOT of Cthulhu Mythos is my day. Once I saw him on this bracket I just knew where my vote was going! πŸ™‚

  • Samuel

    *Groan* Dude, please, do me the courtesy of reading my stuff with even half the care you devote to a giant squid-monster. I said Aslan was omnipotent in his OWN REALITY. That doesn’t correlate to invincibility or ultimate power IN THIS TOURNAMENT, just to a likelihood of greater relative power than calamari-boy. I’ve acknowledged that, numerous times. I’ve stated it about every way I can think of. And yet, every time I glance back here, there you are again, all “Cthulhu will win b/c he’s awesome. And no one can be unable to lose in a tournament”, ignoring every argument I make and just going on and on, setting up these straw man arguments.
    It’s getting kind of annoying. The character in the Narnia books clearly has mystical powers sufficient to create and destroy worlds, move between them, yadda yadda. I have made the point that his power level is greater than Cthulhu’s. If you have a counterargument, let’s hear it. In all your exhaustive reading of Lovecraft’s texts, perhaps you found a reference to Cthulhu’s ability to survive a universe collapsing on him. Perhaps you noticed a remark documenting the fact that he should have beaten the “head honcho god” in his own reality, had not his powers been diffused elsewhere. Whatever. I don’t care. I’d accept any of these as legit arguments, admit I’m mistaken, and there we go. I’m not particularly fond of the Great Hello Kitty. I’d be willing to admit he’s going down if there was any reason to think so. But I need an actual argument first, not this waffling. The only one you’ve made is that this is a fight to the death. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t remember that being mentioned. A defeat should be perfectly sufficient.

  • Samuel

    Followup: In fact, as I recall, the guys in charge themselves wrote Aslan as winning despite getting killed in their little prediction of the Eragon/Aslan match. This really seems to be just “who can get rid of the other guy so he don’t get up again”.

  • The Mad Arab

    I don’t ever recall reading that Aslan could destroy an entire universe. Especially one that isn’t his. Ever. The world of Narnia? Maybe. But a universe? I doubt it. But I digress.
    My argument for Cthulhu winning has never been “He Am Awsome.” My argument, against Aslan specifically, was that similar “all-powerful” and “omnipotent” supposedly could not kill him either. He is of a God, of that make no mistake, his parentage comprising two other gods that gave him birth. He, too, possesses the ability to travel between worlds as was mentioned mumerous times in Lovecraft’s works.
    He is not a Giant Squid or Octopus as you folks are so quick to lobby about. In fact, the best description of him was that he “yielded simultaneous pictures of an octopus, a dragon, and a human caricature; A pulpy, tentacled head surmounted a grotesque scaly body with rudimentary wings.”
    It is impossible to compare the power levels of two fictional characters from two wholly different fictional worlds. Whether or not Aslan can wipe out Narnia is of no consequence, becuase there is no way to prove or disprove his power would have any affect on Cthulhu at all. His “omnipotence” over a world he created would be the same as mine over something I built with legos when I was 5. Cthulhu is similarly powerful in his way, as he can easily wipe out our world; a theme which runs through all the Cthulhu Mythos stories involving him. Did he create this world? No. But that does not make him less powerful for it. It’s mever stated the he can create worlds, but that means little. Just because I didn’t cook the steak I just ate doesn’t mean I can’t do it. Cthulhu’s powers are never fully defined. But this is because he is dormant in the stories he is portrayed in. Dormant, but still able to affect our world through dreams or his so-called “Star-Spawn.” Even asleep, he is contstantly displayed as a hideous danger to life on our world.
    Aslan has never faced A God from a whole other Universe before that I know of. There is no possible way of telling how or even if his powers would work in such a confrontation. Same with Cthulhu. None. So saying that he is “more powerful” or that Cthulhu is “Second best” is conjecture on your part as Cthulhu is never fully defined. Gods require believers, and both have that. But neither would believe in the other so maybe neither would be able to use their powers. But in this case, as I have stated, Cthulhu does dwarf the kitty. By alot.
    As I was attempting to point out at the end of my last reply, this is not personal for me. I’m simply voting for the character I like best. Which is the point here. I’m not trying to antagonize you believe it or not. But I will never say flat out that Aslan or Cthulhu is more powerful than the other. I have never claimed Cthulhu was undefeatble, (He cannot die, but that’s not to say there aren’t ways to drive him off) nor will I ever believe that Aslan is. For the record, in Lovecraft’s works it is never stated why Cthulhu is dormant to my knowledge. It is given as a possible, but so is hibernation. The former situation might never have happened. So his supposedly “being vunerable to such a power” might be inaccurate.
    My long, rambling point? Just because Aslan created a world doesn’t make him more powerful, as you can’t compare the two to begin with. Do I think Cthulhu is more powerful? I couldn’t give a damn. I still think he’s going to pick almost every other competitor in this thing from his tentacles. I don’t care what anyone here thinks of him and I never did. I didn’t write the guy, I just enjoy the stories.
    We’re all fans here. Let’s keep it civil. πŸ™‚

  • The Mad Arab

    Edit: the “Former Situation” I was referring to above was Cthulhu being locked away by a higher being. Somehow that did not get typed out.

  • dpomerico

    And that’s the end of that chapter!
    Thanks for all your votes and comments–you guys make this site rock.
    Make sure to see if Cthulhu beats his next opponent, Jaime Lannister, here:

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